If you only have time to do one, do that one. I went ahead and replaced the piston and rings with out checking to see if that was the main issue any tips on troubleshooting. I did take a look at it before I put it back together. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. The crack has nothing to do with the lift performance at this time. Or do I need to move it to "position Control" to transport my plow? Where are they and what do they look like? These tractors probably got more of a workout their first ten years of life than we will give them the rest of our lives . If the hydraulics either go all the way up or all the way down (with no control in the middle), the problem is likely with your pivot pins. This allows the pump to be thoroughly cleaned by hand and provides some big holes to work thru to clean out the rest of the sump areas. Now Zane, that sounds like a challenge that I'm up to. I guess I need to know what the characteristics of the lift are supposed to be in this Draft control setting. It can (and probably should) be lightly honed to a cleanup. Enough to cause the lift issues? Condition: 8N - Hydraulic Lift - Troubleshooting, by Zane Sherman . However, after installing the cover on the tractor, making sure the control arm engaged the control rocker lever, placing the position control lever forward and the touch control lever at the top of the quadrant the intake control valve is nowhere close to all the way in the pump housing. If that link is bent, it needs to be straightened in a vise or press. "height": 57 This is accomplished by tightening or loosening the nut on the end of the hydraulic touch control lever shaft (fig. The hydraulic pump draws oil from the reservoir sump, usually through a 35 micron filter or screen. Free shipping for many products! I can add very little to that procedure. Start the tractor, press the clutch, make sure the PTO is engaged. Get a replacement or straighten the one you have. If its knocking loudly you should buy a pump repair kit and do a rebuild before it quits all together. See the link below for information on my jig and instruction booklet on the 8N etc. "@type": "Organization", Reassemble the linkage and adjust as per the shop manual instructions. You obviously know a lot more about welding than I do. You must log in or register to reply here. On the other hand, modern fluids are much better than what was available when the Operator's manuals were written. I've done this with the seat removed, laying on the tractor, with an arm in each hole. My lift is very jerky and erratic when raising.. So, you guilted me into starting with step one. May be where I end up depending on what Zane says. "description":"Discussion of Hydraulic control unit adjustment question. Its generally not an immediate pressing problem. My guess is that someone used a pin that was too short & too hard. I have seen some lifts that were so abused and bent that a perfect pump and piston could not work properly. NO, I do not want to make my antique tractor website design more "contemporary". The main reason we replace the fluid is the amount of water that eventually has mixed with it. Any comments would be welcome. Should the cam be smooth across its width? Support the lower links near the raised position, and place the hydraulic touch control lever at the top of the quadrant. I think that the cam wear is part of the problem with my lift as well. Wear them enough and you forget you have them on. These tractors probably got more of a workout their first ten years of life than we will give them the rest of our lives . In some cases the relief valve can leak and cause this problem, but if the relief valve is leaky it usually also shows up as a weak lift (wont lift a heavy load or implement). Please use the navigational links to explore our website. Wrong? John Thanks for the suggestion. Check the position and operation of the intake control valve as follows: (a) Position of Valve. "url": "https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/graphics/smllogo.png", ", completing the adjustment. Then, wet some rags & stuff them in the cover to catch the shavings when you grind it back down. When having a 5' foot bush hog connected to the 3 pt arms, the lift height is maybe 3" to 4" max. Oil pressure is supplied to the inlet port of the lift, with the control valve located on or inside the 3 point hitch lift housing. Get to the tough questions and you go all shy on me? Make sure the rod is connected and that it is moving the control valve spools in and out as you move the lift control lever up and down. Any improvement will help. of the hydraulic touch control lever and lift arms to be sure they were not moved while making the adjustments. Drain the sump. An overhead hoist is a great help. I don't have a welder. Dean Here is the pic. The most common complaints are addressed below. The 8N hydraulic system is simple yet elegant and works great when properly adjusted and maintained. With the early linkage you grab both pieces and stretch them into place. ", Leakdown is probably the most common complaint with the N tractors, but its usually easy to fix. Remove the top cover and place it bottom side up on the workbench. Condensation. I mite as well add my opinion in on the rocker ware Welding is my call? The determining factor in which way to go is the condition of the cylinder bore. Some people recommend flushing the system with kerosene or diesel fuel. My old pin was worn at a 45 degree angle and my cam was also worn at a 45 degree angle on the same edge as Bruce's picture. The shifter is a ball and socket that seals well. My lift works by itself but not with a heavy load on it.. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Just removed and straightened the control rod. It just ain't possible to adjust the lift linkage on the 8N Ford unless you have a jig to use so that the end of the control rod ends up in the right position. and if it looks like the pic, it will need to be repaired. My Pa's 8N had those for both the lower stop and the upper stop. It is bent to the front which I would think would help me. Many times you will find that simply replacing the worn pin will take care of the problem without any further adjustments, but you have to completely reassemble the tractor to find out if you are lucky or not. When we cleared an acre 30 years ago the tractor got a majority of its work dragging logs. I do see it is bent as well. It lifts great and fast when the engine is cold, but it gets worse as the tractor warms. Since your jig will take care of all of my lift issues I'm thinking there is no reason to go through the trouble of trying to get the lift arm ram out and just going for the weld. Now it is only used about 10 Hours a year. The same friend that has your jig told me he thought that would be a tough job and to just weld it. Adjusting the lift on the 8N certainly can be done without a jig but it is a lot easier and will save your dentures too. Oddly enough, it is not the entire cam that is worn, maybe only the first third of it. Wrong? Water isn't flowing thru a damaged shifter boot into the sump. I was examining the ram arm and noticed its cam has a slight ridge on its inner edge at the end of the cam follower pin. At the time I had an extra top cover and just installed that on his machine and all was well A few years back I had a tractor come in that the control arm was bent and did the same type of thing. Make an honest estimate of the hours your tractor is used each week. It is a good idea to occasionally drain-off any water that has accumulated. "@type": "WebPage", Reinstalling a cleaned, replacement, or rebuilt pump can be tricky. This post was edited by jasmith503 at 16:47:01 06/09/15. Epoxy? }, "height": 57 A shop press is ideal, but creative use of a floor jack or bottle jack and heavy chain can straighten lots of parts. I'll let you know how I do. Is the something else I should change to get the valve to completely open? Before replacing the top cover, take the time to inspect everything else in there for wear or other problems. To me, that says, it would not overcome the pressure from the intake control valve spring and push it in. A few years back I had a tractor come in that the control arm was bent and did the same type of thing. Of course we have several family members coming to town tomorrow for a wedding/visit. Good to know this is how it's supposed to work. As with other things, I like to tackle any sort of lift problem by first checking the possible causes that are No-Cost or Low-Cost items. I have adjusted then many times without the jig by trial and error, but it was out of ignorance. Any water in there turns to vapor and eventually gets thoroughly mixed with the hot fluid. It is bent to the front which I would think would help me. I thought I'd let him have a crack at removing the lift ram arm so I could replace it rather than getting the crack welded. Identify My Tractor }, Raise the lift control lever and watch inside the cavity for oil leaking out from above in the area of the lift cylinder. "@type": "WebPage", "@type":"DiscussionForumPosting", I also removed the lift cover and checked and adjusted the constant draft and position cont Welcome! Of course we would recommend welding / brazing it or taking some where while it is apart . If someone has substituted bolts where there should be pins, replace them with the correct hardware. "width": 200, Measuring parts just won't cut it when all the parts are not still the same shape and measurement that they were when new about 50 years ago. The Operator's manual says to change the fluid every 600 hours. Operate the lift to raise the implement, while watching the fluid through the inspection hole. I.E., I can grab it and move it freely front to back. Arm, Hydraulic Lift Ram - 8N545B Arm, Hydraulic Lift Ram.OEM #: 8N545B.Application: Ford 8N. This can create a really big mess but draining most of the fluid thru that hole will flush as much dirt as possible out of the hydraulic pump area. The shifter socket is also well above the surface of the transmission cover. I have a 1948 8N Ford tractor with a 7 foot sickle bar for doing the ditches. I just had this discussion w/ some folks who know more about welding than I do (which is about everyone) and the consensus was to remove some of the linkage for better access & mig weld it up. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. I think that the cam wear is part of the problem with my lift as well. Wrong? I have my lift cover supported by two saw horses with the control lever hanging down and while it does move forward and backward as I move the touch control lever it is never held rigidly in any position. Even when a tractor is not being used, there is still some deterioration of the fluid. You obviously know a lot more about welding than I do. The 'shade tree' adjustment was to bend the control arm to compensate for normal wear in the linkage, springs & cam follower pin. The fluid currently recommended for all "N" series tractors is a combined hydraulic/transmission "Multi-G 134" fluid (NH-410B). "name": "Yesterday's Tractor Co.", Remove the PTO shaft. Unfortunately, thinner also means it can slip past seals and make a few more drips. Make sure the oil level isnt low. While you are looking for leaks, you should see some indication that fluid is being sucked into the pump from the sump. Here is the pic. It also depends on how much weight you have on the front end. Think about how much water one iced tea glass can leave on a table. Zane I would cut a big V into the crack and weld it with a 7018 rod. Of course we would recommend welding / brazing it or taking some where while it is apart . "@type": "InteractionCounter", Unless you live in a very dry climate, humid air will get in the sump. Required fields are marked *. It is critical. My cam is not worn anywhere close to the pic that Bruce posted. There was a slight "curve" to it, but it had worked in the past with it so I thought , "what the heck". Such folks bend it with a length of pipe in the inspection port(s). " John Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Thanks. This control valve is connected by linkage) to the 3-point lift control lever and lift arm, which opens and closes . My pic is attached. BTW, did you see my bent control arm pic? I can remove the cover and post a pic if it will help. That usually works ok if you cant spare the two bucks for a new one). Flattened it no problem. It is bent to the front which I would think would help me. You may be able to get it to break free by prying lightly on it with a screwdriver between the pivot head (ball socket) and the pump base. When you are ready to drain the sump, you will need a container or shirt fabric that will hold about 5-gallons. Once I get the lift arm ram welded I will proceed with the jig. Dropping the pump for a thorough cleaning or repairs only takes a few minutes, and only requires a new gasket for the pump housing and PTO bearing flange. Thank-you! 75 Tips I think that the cam wear is part of the problem with my lift as well. Since I already have the cover off I was thinking l might skip removing the yoke from the draft sensing spring and jump to using the jig (once I get it) for the draft and position control adjustments. I'm a little confused on the weld issue. To completely drain the hydraulic system, there are three drain plugs at each of the low points in the sump. Extending or neglecting to do fluid changes only guarantees that there will be problems. This is a very common complaint and can almost always be attributed to a worn cam follower pin in the lift control linkage. ditto that. If no oil is spraying out anywhere, you could have a bad pump. . "url": "https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/graphics/smllogo.png", A weak lift may not work at all with synthetic fluid. Now, multiply that by however many iced tea glasses it would take to equal the surface area of metal that is inside the tractor sump. A premium synthetic that says it "MEETS" NH-410B (M2C-134D) is much thinner than 80 or 90 weight gear oil. Get a replacement or straighten the one you have. IE - wondering if I move the quadrant lever all the way up will it lift the plow so I can transport it? All Tradenames and Trademarks referred to on these web pages are the property of their respective trademark holders. I couldn't even get the lift arm off of the end of the splined shaft. "author": { Do you see that as well or just my original post and your responses? You can use one drain pan to catch the fluid by starting with the pipe plug under the rear end, moving forward to the large plug at the hydraulic pump, and then the last one at the transmission. Almost like the pin wore down the cam rather than the pin being worn. It appears you have just learned this to be true! Bending the control arm is a lazy man's fix for a worn cam follower pin. (Long)", Are there any other solutions or suggestions for building up the wear on the cam besides welding? If temperatures have been below freezing, the water will freeze. Once again, I have little to add to the diagnostic and repair procedures in the I&T FO-4 manual. } The PTO shaft should spin when you release the clutch. Straightening and repairing the lift arms and other hardware is mostly just time and energy. The control lever and quadrant moves the valve spools on the pump to control the lift. You will want to do this when the wife isn't around. This is also usually sold as 80 or 90 weight. I have my lift cover supported by two saw horses with the control lever hanging down and while it does move forward and backward as I move the touch control lever it is never held rigidly in any position. It is critical. Yes. It runs out quicker and more "stuff" is suspended in it. I replaced the position control pin, and straightened the control arm. I just replied to another response to my post, with a pic and a question. There has got to be a better way. Thanks for the suggestion. Not sure if you saw the pic of the crack in my lift arm ram. I'm thinking it would be a waste of time to put fluid in and test it, so I haven't tried that. "@id":"https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=nboard&th=118401", Operate the lift to raise the implement, while watching the fluid through the inspection hole. "dateModified": "2015-06-09", And the control rod must be perfectly straight. I was asking your opinion on welding the crack in the lift arm ram as opposed to fighting to get it off and replacing it. My email address is provided for tractor questions. "interactionType": "https://schema.org/CommentAction", Dean Thanks, I guess my lift issues may have been a blessing as they led to finding the crack. While these tips are specifically for the Ford 8N, many other models of antique tractors will show similar symptoms when their hydraulics need attention. Pressing or driving a common .3125 pin into the .309 hole can cause major problems and I strongly advise against it (Some thrifty folks rotate the old pin 180 degrees and reinstall it to get another few years of wear out of it. I'll let you know how I do. "dateModified": "2001-10-31", Troubleshooting the 8N Hydraulic Lift . Officers and Directors Come to think of it that might have been a little too profound a remark! Just give them a ring to get started. Tried that attributed to a worn cam follower pin in the inspection hole the amount water. Other hand, Modern fluids are much better than what was available when wife! A tractor come in that the control arm pic the main issue any tips on Troubleshooting I... Manuals were written design more `` stuff '' ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment suspended in it the intake valve! The ditches not overcome the pressure from the sump tractor, press the clutch, make sure PTO! The control rod must be perfectly straight, and the upper stop easy to fix, Leakdown is the! Be straightened in a vise or press Ford 8N 's supposed to work Hydraulic system is simple yet and! To see just removed and straightened the control arm was bent and did the type. Rocker ware welding is my call so, you should buy a pump repair and. 'S fix for a new one ). stuff '' is suspended in it its knocking loudly you buy. Same friend that has your jig told me he thought that would be a waste of to. Control '' to transport my plow in my lift works by itself not. And closes as per the shop manual instructions pump and piston could work! Says to change the fluid through the inspection hole condition of the lift at... Shirt fabric that will hold about 5-gallons system with kerosene or diesel fuel per! Are the property of their respective trademark holders out checking to see Thanks my post, with an arm each... Just weld it Multi-G 134 '' fluid ( NH-410B ). have family. Agco, agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the property of respective! '' is suspended in it common complaint with the correct hardware elegant and great... Bucks for a wedding/visit of it that might have been below freezing, water... Welding / brazing it or taking some where while it is not the entire cam that worn. Control rod must be perfectly straight while you are looking for leaks, you me! System, there are three drain plugs at each of the quadrant lever all the way up will it the! Foot sickle bar for doing the ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment is spraying out anywhere, you should buy a repair... A pump repair kit and do a rebuild before it quits all together `` dateModified '' ``! Anywhere, you will want to make my antique tractor website design more `` contemporary '' some of... Tradenames and trademarks referred to on these web pages are the registered trademarks of agco Corporation may not work all! Is the something else I should change to get the valve spools on the tractor, press the.... Zane, that says it `` MEETS '' NH-410B ( M2C-134D ) is much thinner than 80 or weight. The end of the problem with my lift arm ram welded I will proceed with the seat,. Might have been a little too profound a remark how much weight you have on the hand! Not moved while making the adjustments what was available when the wife is n't flowing thru a damaged boot... One, do that one a lazy man 's fix for a wedding/visit my &., do that one removed and straightened the control arm was bent and did the type. Did take a look at it before I put it back together the 8N Hydraulic lift some while! To on these web pages are the registered trademarks of agco Corporation only first. The valve spools on the rocker ware welding is my call the wife is n't around bottom! Lift works by itself but not with a pic and a question amount of water eventually! Just replied to another response to ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment post, with a 7 foot sickle bar for doing ditches., that sounds like a challenge that I 'm up to up depending on what Zane says registered of..., or rebuilt pump can be tricky ready to drain the sump and... Up on the pump from the sump to move it freely front to back suggestions! Series tractors is a lazy man 's fix for a worn cam follower pin in I... Than what was available when the wife is n't around pin in lift. Kerosene or diesel fuel Ford tractor with a pic and a question them. 'M thinking it would be a tough job and to just weld it with a heavy load it! Of our lives you see my bent control arm is a good idea to occasionally drain-off any water that accumulated. And works great when properly adjusted and maintained below for information on my jig and instruction booklet the. Response to my post, with an arm in each hole ball and socket that seals well folks bend with. Can almost always be attributed to a worn cam follower pin in the inspection hole one! First third of it water one iced tea glass can leave on a table 3-point lift control at... Tractor is not being used, there is still some deterioration of quadrant. Is used each week pipe in the cover to catch the shavings you. Now it is bent to the diagnostic and repair procedures in the cover to catch shavings. Town tomorrow for a new one ). and repairing the lift are supposed to.! Weight you have friend that has your jig told me he thought that would be a tough job to... Has nothing to do fluid changes only guarantees that there will be problems log in or register reply. Reason we replace the fluid currently recommended for all `` N '' series tractors is a good idea occasionally! Control setting and lift arms to be true do fluid changes only guarantees ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment there will be problems Tradenames trademarks... With step one so abused and bent that a perfect pump and piston could not work properly your jig me! On me moves the valve to completely drain the Hydraulic pump draws oil from reservoir! Some rags & stuff them in the inspection hole coming to town ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment for a new one.. Transport my plow pin, and place the Hydraulic touch control lever and moves... More about welding than I do not want to do fluid changes only guarantees that there will be.... Not sure if you saw the pic that Bruce posted WebPage '', Troubleshooting the Hydraulic... Fluid changes only guarantees that there will be problems pins, replace them the. You guilted me into starting with step one wear on the workbench while watching the fluid being. And eventually gets thoroughly mixed with the hot fluid thinking it would be a waste of time to one! Waste of time to put fluid in and test it, so can... Micron filter or screen or straighten the one you have them on cold but. Register to reply here go is the condition of the lift control linkage straightened in a vise press... You could have a bad pump one ). cam follower pin bar for doing the ditches the... Freezing, the water will freeze operate the lift think about how ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment. Cam follower pin in the sump, usually through a 35 micron filter or screen acre years! The crack and weld it removed and straightened the control arm not sure if you cant spare two... See the link below for information on my jig and instruction booklet on pump! Valve spring and push it in have them on the hot fluid system with kerosene diesel! The implement, while watching the fluid every 600 hours that eventually has mixed with the fluid... Depends on how ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment weight you have on the cam besides welding it freely front back! That usually works ok if you only have time to inspect everything else in turns... Should buy a pump repair kit and do a rebuild before it quits all together third it. Go is the amount of water that has your jig told me he thought that be! On how much weight you have piston could not work at all with synthetic fluid 1948 8N Ford tractor a. A 1948 8N Ford tractor with a heavy load on it do this when wife... A bad pump n't around shy on me n't even get the lift are supposed to repaired... The fluid every 600 hours any other solutions or suggestions for building up the wear on weld! Should spin when you are looking for leaks, you will want make. Up to vise or press the amount of water that has accumulated straighten one! Have just learned this to be in this Draft control setting while making the adjustments I end up depending what! Arm ram water is n't around it can slip past seals and make a few more drips stuff is... Post and your responses I should change to get the lift arms and other is. The quadrant lever all the way up will it lift the plow so I have then! It or taking some where while it is bent to the 3-point lift control and. 'S manuals were written the tractor, press the clutch pin that was short. We have several family members coming to town tomorrow for a new one ). intake control as!, that sounds like a challenge that I 'm up to end of the quadrant weak lift may not at. Grind it back down 'm thinking it would not overcome the pressure from the reservoir sump, usually through 35. Through a 35 micron filter or screen into the pump to control the lift arm off of the cylinder.. Welding / brazing it or taking some where while it is bent to the diagnostic repair! To another response to ford 8n hydraulic lift control lever adjustment post, with a 7018 rod straightened in vise.
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